Shaping the B2B Funnel

If you're selling to business or to business leaders, you're in the B2B space. And if you're in the B2B Space, Funnel is everything. Your sales process is longer, more conceptual and a higher ticket value than the average off-the-shelf business or consumer product. That means the success of your business will be heavily dependent on how you influence those conversations.

Where pay-per-click, events or outreach are effective ways to get customers to become aware of your offer, the length and depth of your sales process means that your sales funnel will be full of "maybes". These are the buyers who are interested but need more convincing to get over the line. That's where podcasts are a powerful tool to influence B2B Sales.

A large proportion of these "maybes" will go check out your backstory (ie. listen to the podcast), they will want to know more about your thought processes and measure your authenticity. These can be rarely be achieved through a blog post or "about us" section. The most valuable maybes will want to learn more about you before they learn about your product, so having that podcast content available will have a significant impact on your sales closing rate.

Listen to the Podcast

Podcast Guesting Pro founder Graham Brown joins podcast host James Harper on The "B2B Sales and Entrepreneurship" podcast to discuss podcast guesting and B2B Sales. The following is a transcript of their conversation.

If you want to talk to our team about podcast guesting and B2B Sales, book a free consultation here.

Narrator (00:00) 

AgencyFlare.com presents Two-Cent$ Worth a podcast on B2B sales and entrepreneurship. The one podcast that's not afraid to discuss real sales strategies with real entrepreneurs that produce real results. Here's your host, James Harper

 

James Harper (00:24)                   

Hey, what's up everyone. Welcome back to the Two-Cent$ Worth podcast. I'm your host James Harper. If you wanna learn how storytelling and positioning can help you win more business and ultimately sell better. This is the episode for you. I had the awesome opportunity to sit down with Graham Brown, who is one hell of an entrepreneur when it comes to storytelling and positioning and really helping you find your category and your niche, because ultimately that's gonna allow you to be more intentional and sell better.

We really get into the specifics on how storytelling can be powerful, but then understanding how your story, presents for a personal brand and how that personal brand then presents to your prospects. We really kind of cover the entire gamut of topics when it comes to the storytelling realm and how you can implement that into a more efficient business and sales process. And more than anything, I just ultimately enjoyed the flow and chemistry that this episode had with Graham.

You're gonna get a ton of knowledge and after learning a little bit more about Graham. I'll tell you one thing, there's not many people in the podcast world that know more than what Graham does when it comes to leveraging podcasts for your own benefit and just content in general and it's something that we should all be asking ourselves as sales entrepreneurs, how are we utilizing our content to make impact to help us win future business? So without any further ado, please welcome Graham Brown.

Hey, Graham, how's it going? I would say thanks for joining me this evening, but where I'm at in the world. It's morning for you. So, thanks for joining me here today.

 

Graham Brown (02:09)                   

It's great to be here. Thanks, James. Thanks for the invite. Looking forward to this.

James Harper (02:14)                        

Yeah, I am as well. Graham, for simple introductions, why don't you just tell everyone the story of Graham as I like to call it. Give us a little bit background by yourself.

 

Graham Brown (02:24)                             

Okay, be epic! Well, I'm a storyteller. Which really is something that I grew up with as a kid, telling stories, I mean, we all love stories as kids, right? When we sat around, listened to our parents read stories, or teachers would say gather around it's only later in life, I realized you could actually make money out of telling stories. And I think if you're an entrepreneur as well, that storytelling is probably one of the most underutilized, yet most powerful skills, especially in sales. So hopefully we're gonna talk about that today. And really what I've done over the last well since I started this podcast agency in 2018 is helped other people tell stories. I think one of the biggest challenges we have as entrepreneurs is this imposter syndrome that I'm not Elon Musk, I'm not a billionaire. So why does anyone want to hear my story? And that's what I deal with essentially on a day-to-day basis. So yeah, telling stories is what I do, but not in that sort of like you when your mom would scold you, don't tell stories James or I’ll give you a slap. So, but I think, that's what puts us off telling stories, but really, if you look at business, it's one of the most powerful tools out.

 

James Harper (03:37)                             

Absolutely. I think that's well said there, Graham, I think storytelling is very critical. Especially if you're in sales, you have to paint the picture, I think it really adds connection. I read something about you that I found really interesting where I don't know if you've spoken about it or if you've written about it, but it says, ‘Find your start before you find your why’ and talking about like agile storytelling break that down for me. When you say, find your start before you find your, why, what exactly do you mean by that?

 

Graham Brown (04:08)                  

There's a lot of pressure on us, entrepreneurs, especially if you're a founder and an owner-operator to find your why. There's the book, isn’t it, by Simon Sinek about Find Your Why, which is actually a good book. I do like it and I think he's definitely a good author and communicator. The challenge is, is there's this pressure that we have to have this overarching ‘why’ in what we do. So, if you are in business development, if you are selling, you have to have this world-changing, game-changing the narrative, I'm putting a dent in the universe or I'm changing the world, or this is the next $10 billion app. I find that most entrepreneurs, if not a very large proportion of them don't have a ‘why’. They don't get out of bed going, “I'm gonna change the world.” We don't really, that's the median myth about entrepreneurship. Maybe some do.

Maybe there was a guy at college who was really into drawing airplanes. And then when he graduated, he worked for Boeing and now he's designing airplanes for his life, but that's like 1%, right. Most of us are sort of bumbling about life trying to find breaks and then something comes, and you just instinctively think this is a good idea and you're gonna do it.

So, I think, what puts most of us off the entrepreneurial journey is this idea that we have to have this big ‘Why’, and maybe we then become doubting, we doubt our own intentions as to why we do this. What I say to people is rather than finding your ‘why’, find your start because it's an agile process. Just get started, like podcast, like this guest on the podcast, start a podcast, talk to people, get out there, the moment of truth, get on the virtual stage and face rejection and just keep practicing, practicing, practicing.

No comedian was born funny. This is the reality is that, Jerry Seinfeld probably did 10,000 hours of standup to become funny or Kevin Hart, for example. And it's the same with us is that we've got to just keep moving, start and the ‘Why’ comes, later on. Steve Jobs never set out to redefine the IT industry and mobile phones and communication. He just set out because he liked designing things. And that's a start, right? So, all of us in us have a start and the why is something which really is a postscript to our journey, if you like. It's easier. It's like a book, if you don't really understand the book until the last chapter, then it also comes together. That’s a bit like our ‘why’ isn’t it?

 

James Harper (07:00)                            

It's a good way to look at it. And a unique perspective. I haven't really thought about it in that realm. I like to, I guess when you were speaking there, what kept coming to my mind was imperfect action. Go ahead and take action and don't wait for the timing to be perfect. It's never perfect. And for me, when I started in entrepreneurship and started playing the game of business, it was really about, just figuring it out. And I still feel I'm figuring it out as you scale up and you level up. But then as you level up and as you grow, different things become important. Now it's like, okay, now I could use the money for impact, now I could use business to provide jobs, now I'm starting to define maybe a purpose, maybe a why. But it all started with like what you said, find your start, find what works, and then just keep going, because I mean, so many people don't even get to the starting line, let alone the finish line.

 

Graham Brown (07:59)                   

Yeah, there's a lot of pressure, isn't there about that? That you maybe if when you were starting out, people may have said, what's your why? I don't know. I just, I know what I don't want to do maybe, more than I do wanna do. And I wake up in the morning. I don't wanna work in the bank anymore, or I don't want to grind the way for somebody else. Yeah, that's a good motivating factor, but it's not a big why, but that's a good start.

 

James Harper (08:26)                   

Yeah. And totally. And in sales, I like to say, your purpose, your motivation, your why, whatever you wanna call it, it could just be like, Hey! I want to be successful. And then you get to define what successful is and you don’t have to overcomplicate this thing. And I love Simon Sinek, but I've often thought about that book - Start with why. I've often thought about that. It's not always relevant to everything and everyone. So I think it's, you're the first person I've ever on this show with hundreds of conversations that find your start versus your why. And I actually totally agree with that. I want to dive into something that I find interesting, you talk about the power of defining your category and B2B sales and marketing. Talk to me what you mean by that. We talk about the more niche, the more rich, the more when it comes to your sales approach, how you can really carve out your space and become an expert within that space? I'm curious what you mean by the power of defining a category? I think that's really interesting.

 

Graham Brown (09:33)                             

Yeah. This is a really interesting area. Category narratives - it's really the power to define your industry and where you see yourself. Your niche is really a core part of this. I don't know if you've seen it. There's a documentary series on Netflix at the moment called Billion Dollar Code. It's about these two German guys who discover the precursor to Google Earth and there's that all that IP issue going on. And it culminates in this six-part series, I think with this last scene where they're in the court. So these two coders are taking on Google and the lawyers, and there's what they call the opening statements in any trial where the prosecutor will stand up, and then the defense lawyer will stand up and they give this opening statement to the jury. And in this scene, the coders’ lawyer stands up and said, this is about flying and she tries to paint it in this very beautiful terms of flying around the earth and going from place to place and this is like this really free form flow of information. And then the Google's lawyers stand up and said, this is not about flying, this is about patents. This is about IP. This is about the protection of property. And so, you think about it every court case, whether you watch your True Crime or Billion Dollar Code, has these opening statements. And the reason why they have them is that they're trying to define everything that follows. They're trying to get the jury to see the world through a lens, which is a narrative. So if I can get you to see the world through this lens and everything I give you as data follows.

And it's the same with business and sales, because if you can define the narrative, then everybody else has to follow and there are really good examples of this. Steve Jobs, when he sold the iPod, he didn't stand up and say, this is the world's best MP3 player. When he held up in front of everybody, which there were at the time, there was Creative who was one of the leading MP3 brands at the time. And then, later on, Microsoft came with zoom and it's iPod killer, because it was more memory, more functionality. What happened to that thing? And he stood up and said, this is a tool for the heart.

Now that's a category narrative. That's defining what MP3 player should be, not in terms of its features, but in terms of what it means to us. So, music, we love music, strong, emotional connection, and you see this everywhere.

Probably the biggest example of it that we entrepreneurs can learn from is Red Bull, the energy drink. Now when Red Bull launched it didn't compete in the soda category with Coke because it would lose. Coke had the distribution, it had the brand, it had the awareness, but what Red Bull decided is that, okay, we can't compete in this category with Coke. So let's create our own category, which you call it niche. So we're gonna create our own category called energy drinks, and we're gonna own it. And that's a category narrative because if you can then tell a story about what energy drinks are and what the lifestyle is, you can lead it because Coke could never enter that. Pepsi could never enter that. They tried with Pepsi max and these energy drinks, knockoffs, if you like. But that is what created thought leadership and brand leadership. And that's probably one of the most powerful sales stories out there is to define a category and we can all do that, we can all define the category in which we operate. And if we're not number one in our category, then create a category in which we can be number one in. That's the key for sales.

 

James Harper (13:20)                              

I think that's really a good comparison. Like the Red Bull/Coca-Cola comparison. You're right, they did define a category and I love that. So, hearing this now and thinking out loud here, how would someone get started? I guess what would your recommendations be when it comes to implementing storytelling into their brand? And let's talk about a personal brand, a salesperson, big on LinkedIn personal, has a personal network. How would they start implementing like the storytelling thought leadership to elevate just themselves?

 

Graham Brown (14:03 )                          

It's a long game, firstly. It's a marathon, not a sprint. So, you have to start the process. So we talked about finding your start. Rather than think about what am I all about, just start the storytelling. So, for example, if you're posting on LinkedIn, one of the most powerful stories is the origin myth. Where did this all come from?

You think about, we know Steven was in the garage and Michael Dell, and we've heard all those stories. It applies to us as well. So, what's the background? Where did you come from? How did you get here? Why are you doing this? So those are interesting elements to the story. So I was born in England. I moved to Japan in the nineties, and started teaching English.

I saw the growth of mobile phones in the early nineties and brought that back to London, started a telecoms business. Everybody has these backstories. And they're really important for defining who you are and how we relate to you. Oh, I know you're from Denver. I know you're from Colorado. I know you probably like the big outdoors or you might like skiing, running all these things. Whatever you decide is your backstory. And I can relate to you that way as the audience and that's a starting point. Start with that. And then it evolves because people interact with that? It's like comedy again, stand up, you keep practice, practice, practice. What is it that people resonate with? You might try the story about when you graduated and maybe it flops and the story about when you got married and there was that funny twist, and then maybe people love that. And that story about when you started your business and the accountant ran off with all the money and people love that story. And then you think this is like a comedian building his material, right? And you're sort of like get that feedback. Okay. That sketch worked really well. That didn't work. I'll try a different way. That's the process.

Agile, keep refining it, keep getting out there and you can do that posting, you can create videos, you can guest on other people's podcasts, you can start a podcast, but the point is you've gotta publish. And the more you publish, the more you can get rejected. The more you get rejected, the better you get. That's it. That's the rule. You can't get better without getting rejected. There's no shortcut.

 

James Harper (16:16)                             

Absolutely. I think one of the keywords you said there was being able to relate. Relatability is such a competitive advantage in a sales scenario. And I think that's often we assume our prospects are going to relate to us. We assume our clients are gonna relate to us, but are we being intentional with being relatable? And I think you're right, a good story could do that. And obviously being human and being your authentic self, does that. But a great story does that when you look at speakers on stage, they often start with a story and I think that's wonderful. You talked about, it starts with publishing and putting yourself out there. I agree. And sometimes I think frequency is almost more important than quality as crazy as that sounds, to begin with. Just so you get in the repetition of publishing and getting your reps. How would you say someone like you, who's big in the podcast game, you're big in the storytelling and sales and marketing game, how can a podcast create and drive just thought leadership and content for you across multiple channels? And how has it served your business?

 

Graham Brown (17:34)                            

You made a great point, James, about consistency, because consistency builds quality really, that publishing every day.

Publishing small content every day is much better than once a month. Getting it out there and being regular in people's consciousness, getting on the feed because once you're on the feed, it's gone tomorrow. So you don't exist. You start all over again. So building thought leadership really is about being the X guy. What is the X that you are known for?

Because if you can occupy a part of somebody's mind, their attention, their memory for X, that's an extremely valuable piece of real estate. I'll give you an example, is that not too long ago, I got a WhatsApp message from a friend and he’s an Aussie guy. And Aussie guys like to ban. So, and they like to rib you as they call it, to tease you. And he sent me this WhatsApp message and it was a message that had gone round a podcast, sorry, gone round Australia and it said like during the pandemic, please, please, please, whatever you do, don't start a podcast because everybody was starting a podcast. I thought it was very funny. It was a bit like a public service announcement. He sent it to me, and I've just laughed at it. I sent him smiley faces and the reason why I liked it was okay, it was funny. It’s a dig at podcasters, but also when he thought of podcasting, he thought of me. And that's what I liked about the validation of that messaging is that a lot of people, when they think of podcasting in my network, think of me.

I'm that guy. I'm the podcast guy. You know Graham? Graham who? No, no, no. The podcast Graham, you know him. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. I know him. And that's what I put to everybody is that's what thought leadership is in its simplest terms. If you can be that guy, what are you that guy for, what's James the X guy for? Is it business development sales, or is it something else and everybody who's listening now, what is it that you can be the X guy for? And I say guy in the generic term. Men and women, obviously. That's what I put as a challenge is define your X. What's that box? It may be very small. It may be garden furniture but if you are that guy, people will seek you out. You may not see it around you, but people will seek you out globally for that and that's really what it is. There’s no mystery in thought leadership. That's all it is.

 

James Harper (20:07)                               

Yeah. And I think it goes back to what you were saying earlier, defining your category and then once you define that category and becoming known within that category, and then you're that guy, you're that girl, you're that person. I think that's great. I think that's great stuff, Graham. I'm just curious for someone like you who I would put in the thought leadership category. I mean, you say it's a long game. I agree with that. I think kind of anything worth that has a good reward at the end, like having an audience is a long game. What's your long game looked like? Take me from the early days of Graham podcasting and storytelling  and creating your personal brand to now. What's that look like?  What's that timeline been like? And yeah, just give me some behind-the-curtain stuff from the early days to now.

 

Graham Brown (21:01)                            

So my first podcast, would've been in 2006. When those podcasts were recorded with these devices, which you could plug into a desk phone. So people don't have desk phones anymore, but they did back then when I was doing sales for our telecoms company. And I was having a lot of these calls with these telecoms people, mobile telecoms specifically around the world, around 2006 when things were really picking up. And I thought it would be good to record these and make them public. Obviously, they knew about it and that was the deal. So, you'd have this device, which I supposed is a wiretap of some sort that you could put on your phone and then record it and it was very analog and you'd run it through the old internet cables into your phone, into your laptop.

So that was how I started and obviously, things have progressed a lot since then. Not just in terms of recording, but also the quality and distribution. So, I started way back then in what you call a podcast format. And really I didn't even know that that was a thing and I didn't know that you could make money out of that.

I launched the Asia Tech Podcast when I was living in Japan in 2017 because I wanted to network with people. Nobody was doing podcasts in Asia back then and I wanted to reach out to people and it was a great way of reaching out to people around Asia and the exploding startup scene that they had back then in 2017. And I could access hundreds of people and I got access to hundreds of people and I had a sort of fluke meeting with the CEO of Air Asia, which is Asia's biggest airline. He's a billionaire, he's a bit like a Mark Cuban. If you imagine that character in Asia. A guy called Tony Fernandes, he used to own a Formula 1 team, and a football team. He still owns the football team in the English Premier League, and well-known figure, a big sort of Maverick. Met him by accident once sitting in an outside food court and completely random. We got talking for about an hour, turns out that we both grew up in the same place in England, even though he's Malaysian. And at the end of it, I thought, what am I gonna do here? I've got an opportunity to do something with this guy, there's an open window. I couldn't pitch him, I couldn't do a sales pitch because it just wouldn't have worked. He's heard millions of these. And I said, let's do a podcast. And he said, sure and he gave me his WhatsApp number and then we made it happen.

Several months later I was in their headquarters. This huge headquarters that sits off the airport in Qala Lumpur and we did the podcast together and it’s on YouTube. You can see it there. And it's, to me, that was a turning point because it showed there was a real appetite, but he did Larry King a month before that. And now he was doing a podcast with me. This is a bit surreal. And what it showed me, James, was that it reinforced this idea that podcast is offering something that all these traditional media couldn't and it was. This authentic communication, you can imagine if you're a Mark Cuban or any kind of Maverick character in business that everything you say would be twisted, everything you say would be reinterpreted and reframed for somebody else's agenda, but to speak in your own voice is powerful. And I realized that's what he wanted to do.

He wanted to tell his story in his words with no PR handlers, no media agenda. And that then made me realize actually that is what corporates are looking for, corporate leaders and that was the turning point where I realized that this could be a business, a proper business, and Air Asia were our first clients. And then from that, we sold to corporates. It's basically business leaders. It's the CEOs C suites of these corporations who wanted to tell their stories, not necessarily completely from childhood to the grave, but they would tell their journeys and what they were passionate about. And that's been the journey for me. It's really, it's going back to finding your start again, is that I never set out thinking I'm going to give the business world a voice because we were just a small company, but it has become that almost through the back door.

 

James Harper (25:58)                               

Yeah. Given the business world of voice. I love that. I think that's great. And you sure have. I'm curious, so I got two last things for you here, Graham. One is a fun little question at the end. But the first one, in all seriousness, let's say there's a young sales entrepreneur listening to this show right now. What's one piece of advice you'd give them? It can be anything but someone that's just like in the grind, brand new, starting out. What's one thing they can do that might move the needle for them?

 

Graham Brown (26:37)                            

I have been there. I remember my first, I'm sure you've got similar stories, James is that my first real corporate sales job in the nineties was working in something similar to Boiler Room. I don’t know if you've seen that movie where there was pitching. And it was like that. And we weren't selling stocks where we were selling financial products, but it was a little bit more legit than Boiler Room. But I remember joining in, in my first week there, they had this guy who joined with me and he didn't do the right number of calls. It was one of those you've gotta make all these calls on the list. You've got to knock them out every single day. So what they did is they got some duct tape and they duct tape the phone to his head. And then he was forced to make the calls. It was very old school, macho sales environment. I grew up with that and I saw that and I was horrified by it and they made this guy stand and make these calls and it's an environment where they said you can come in at any time you want. That's the beauty of this business. It's flexible hours. As long as you start before eight o'clock in the morning, you gotta make 120 calls before you go home.

It was tough, man. And I looked at that and I thought, there's gotta be another way of doing this, you know. And I think a lot of people look at sales and it's tainted by that imagery. But then I was very curious, what is sales? I started a business. I wanted to know what sales was and it isn't just this, it isn't like a hundred calls a day. Sure there are things we can learn from it. I'm sure you and I both have this discipline of numbers as sales guys. You've got your sheet and your funnel and your process. Well, you've got to have that but just banging away. Pitch is not sales. That's that brute force, low intelligence sales. The reality is that and this is my advice to anybody starting out, there are many different ways you can sell. So you can sell obviously 120 calls a day, you could sell writing a blog article with good copywriting that is really good sales.

You could sell with a podcast. You could sell by making a video. You can sell by writing a book. There are many, many different ways. My advice to everybody is explore them all and find what works for you because I'm guaranteed what works for you and what works for me are different. We all have a different way of expressing ourselves and just because it's not aggressive ABC - Always Be Closing, just because it's not that doesn't mean it's not sales. Sales is really just about telling stories and getting people to understand where your product fits into their world and there's many, many different ways you can do that. So my advice is explore them all and find what works for you. And don't let anybody tell you that that is not the right way to do it. Because if it works, it works.

 

James Harper (29:35)                               

I love that. And I'm not saying this beacuse it's you speaking to me right now, that's some of the best probably just intro advice that we've gotten on this show here probably in the last 12 months. So, I love that that one size doesn't fit all and I think your sales process and your sales style and the channels you sell in over time will ultimately evolve as well. And those can change and you have to be open to it just because maybe you are someone that hit the phones 120 times and let's say that did work for you 10 years ago doesn't necessarily mean that it'll work today. Maybe times have changed, maybe you've evolved and what channel serves you best to serve. And I think that's what it comes down to. And I think that's great advice. Graham, this is one, thank you again for coming on the show. It's been an awesome conversation, but this probably my favorite part of each show. I have a black box and I have a white box they're filled with 120 random questions and I've never read either one. We're gonna pull out one of these cards and ask you a random question. So would you like to pull from the white box or the black box?

Graham Brown (30:48)                            

What's the difference between the white and black box? Is it one sort of like light and one's darker?

 

James Harper (30:55)                              

Honestly, you're the first person to ask me that and I don't think there's a difference.

 

Graham Brown (31:02)                            

Let's go in the black box. I feel like we have to dive. We've got to go in. You've gotta commit. What you have in the black box?

 

James Harper (31:11)                               

This is kind of funny. What is your favorite body part about yourself?

 

Graham Brown (31:13)                             

[Laughter] Favorite body part? I have to think about this. Favorite body part about myself. I don't know. Do people have a favorite body part? Do you consciously think about it? Or do you lie in your bed like yeah, I'm really pleased about that part of my body. I have to find a Jerry Seinfeld-style answer to this. I don't know. I suppose, I don't know, when I was a kid. I had a lot of problems with my ears and my nose. And I was always going to see the ENT doctor and I couldn't hear properly. And that's how I got into microphones and recording. Because I remember my mom bought me some headphones, very young and this recorder, I could actually hear things better. So I had hearing problems when I was a kid. And I still, if you listen closely, it's there and so I'm glad that that worked out over time. So I don't know, my nose and my ears. They're not the most attractive. I don't particularly like them, but I'm just pleased that they're working. Because now I can do this in a way. I wonder if it all worked out when I was a kid and if my ears were functioning properly and all the tubes were working, then I probably wouldn't have been doing this. Because I wouldn't have had that motivation to get it right. Even, as a kid, I remember at school they would make fun of my voice because I sounded like I permanently had a cold. So they were like doing this and making fun of me. And so I don't know again, you don't have to be motivated to do great things. Sometimes you just gotta prove a few people wrong. That's good enough motivation. No, it's a long answer. I'd say the combination, nose and ears, because their defects have given me the motivation to be here right now with you, James.

 

James Harper (33:06)                               

Yeah. No, I think that's a really well thought out answer. I always think of my eyes so I could see. I mean, I would be to be terrified to be blind, man. I got such admiration for people who are blind. That's a good answer.

 

Graham Brown (33:21)                             

Have you asked that question to anybody else in your show?

 

James Harper (33:24)                               

No I haven’t, man. Those were just random questions, man. You got a tough one there.

 

Graham Brown (33:37)                             

We went with the black so we went into the dark hole. Shady area.

 

James Harper (33:43)                               

Graham, where can people find you, man? I really enjoyed this conversation and we'll link everything in the show notes. Where can people find you?

 

Graham Brown (33:50 )                             

Yeah, go to my website, which is my personal website as opposed to the company website, which is Graham, G-R-A-H-A-M. So it's GrahamDBrown.com. You've gotta put the D in there, D for David. Because if you go on GrahamBrown.com it is a wallpaper company. So it's GrahamDBrown.com

 

James Harper (34:09)                               

Awesome and yeah, I would love to have you back on the show, man. I think this was so valuable and really appreciate it, Graham. Thank you so much.

 

Graham Brown (34:16)                             

James. It was a lot of fun. Thank you very much.


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About The Author Graham Brown

Graham Brown is the founder of Podcast Guesting Pro. Graham is a published author on the subject of Digital Communication and Personal Branding (Amazon titles include "Brand Love: How to Build a Brand Worth Talking About" and "Mobile Youth: Voices of the Connected Generation). He has produced, project managed and guested on over 2,000 podcast episodes.